Am I a fascist? I fear I might be when it comes to the crunch. Even bigger shock horror, I suspect I could be about to rationalize some deeply suspect, callous, ruthless thinking of mine, right here and now. I’m not sure how this is going to pan out. By the end of the blog I may be appalled by what I have said, and so may you. No doubt you will let me know if that is the case, and I might find it painful.
It is just that, as the moderator of Heretic TOC over the period of nearly six months since its inception, I have found it necessary to be rather immoderate in slapping down some contributors to the comments, at times to the point of brutal bluntness – not in public, but behind the scenes in private exchanges. Several departed, never to return; a couple exasperated me so much I banished them permanently. Admittedly, when we consider the history of fascism, my culpability may seem slight: I have not organised bands of thugs in uniforms to beat up my enemies in the street and trash their business premises. I have not disposed of even one “awkward customer” by having him hanged with piano wire, though the thought has crossed my mind a few times.
And that’s it really, I suppose: the thought, the attitude. There are many definitions of fascism, but if we are thinking about an attitude rather than a particular political programme, we can perhaps sum it up in a couple of words: illiberal authoritarianism. In ancient Rome the fasces was a bundle of rods tied around an axe, which symbolised the authority and power of a magistrate. Carried by bodyguards, the fasces suggested strength through unity: a single rod is easily broken, but the bundle is not. And they could be used to beat a man to death on the magistrate’s command.
But why would I wish to be illiberal, when the very name of the blog evokes the valorisation of dissent, as does the tag “Not the dominant narrative”? Also, on the About page, I say “…satire can be savage. I prefer a gentler tone, in line with the kind of society I’d like to see.” Hardly a fascist sentiment, is it?
And yet, believe it or not, over the last six months I have been accused, sometimes in the bitterest terms, of being a near-fascist control freak – and not just by one accuser. They say I am hypocritical; my much vaunted interest in a diversity of views is a sham; not only do I want to showcase my own opinions, I want all the responses in the comments section to echo them as well. Could there be something in it? After all, even Meirion Jones, of the BBC, remarked to me that the commentators here seem to comprise only “like-minded” people – fellow heretics, as it were.
In truth, though, non-heretics show up only very rarely as commentators, and when they do their comments tend to go straight into the trash not because of the views expressed but because they are just outright flamers. Their attacks, devoid of any reasoned argument or relevant information, are designed purely to insult and intimidate. But fire-fighting this inflammatory stuff surely does not make me a fascist: on the contrary, it feels more like fighting fascism.
No, what I have found much harder to deal with is a handful of heretics who have turned up here and revealed themselves to be, well, not to put too fine a point on it, unpleasant crackpots of one sort or another. One man’s crackpot can be another man’s misunderstood genius, though; and with that in mind I have been very careful not to suppress anyone’s views just because I don’t like them. As for the “unpleasant” bit, I believe I have gone out of my way to put up with outright cantankerousness and even extreme personal abuse directed towards me in personal emails by some individuals. I have reasoned that minor-attracted people invariably have a tough life these days; some of them are bound to react badly by lashing out at others; I should make allowances and try to be understanding.
This abuse has not been at all like the “you disgusting sickos” style favoured by outsiders. It is much more personal than that, the aim being to hurt me as an individual by implying I am a poor writer, selfishly motivated, know nothing about kids, etc. There is seldom any real sting in these poison pen letters, though, because they are so obviously illogical: if they really thought, for instance, that Heretic TOC is a crap blog, why would they be desperate – as some clearly are – to continue as commentators on it? Wouldn’t it make more sense to go to a better blog elsewhere, or start their own?
How, you might ask, has such unpleasantness arisen? The answer, very simply, is from my moderation of the comments column. In the About section, I say comments must comply with the law and should aim to be Concise, Courteous, Coherent and Content-rich. Legality is obviously an absolute requirement and it has presented no problems. But I have been kept far busier than I would have wished on the “Four Cs”, especially as regards keeping it sweet in terms of showing respect for other contributors. It is when I exert control in this area, especially, but also in terms of trying to deter sheer waffle, often poorly written, grossly repetitious and irrelevant, that the brickbats start to fly. The result of this control-freakery, I suggest, has been a far more interesting comments column than the average to be found across the internet in general and it also gives the site a touch of class that I find pleasing, not least because it shows a civilized side to us heretics that visiting members of the wider public will rarely if ever have seen before. But is it too polite? Too intellectual? Too sanitized?
I am beginning to be worried, I must admit, not about sanitization as such but about the need to sanitize a site such as Heretic TOC. I had hoped that civilized blog pieces would attract civilized commentators. By and large, mercifully, that has been the case, and I am proud of the very high overall standard of contributions published so far. However, the small minority of exceptions has been deeply troubling. These are people who see themselves as ethical and do manage to post some thought-provoking and worthwhile contributions; but they spoil the effect completely when bitterness gets the better of them, as it often does. That is when the dark side takes over: repetitively angry, empty, self-indulgent dross is on display in the public posts, and the private ones to me are far worse. That is where the real ranting and raving gets into full swing, with everyone, everywhere damned to perdition – including fellow heretics – except of course their own utterly blameless selves.
Ineffective as it is in terms of wounding me personally, such abuse is nonetheless depressing in its wider implications. I find myself wondering, “If I were a parent, would I trust my own kids with these people?” I do not think they are outright psychopaths but they are clearly very troubled guys who have been so hurt and damaged themselves that hitting out at others has become an automatic reflex. That, to my mind, constitutes a dangerous personality, even if it does not meet the accepted psychiatric conditions for any particular disorder, such as narcissism or BPD (borderline personality disorder), which are in any case highly controversial diagnoses.
So am I being a bit of a fascist when I insist on courteous postings and (as a courtesy to all Heretic TOC’s readers) severely edit, or even totally trash, the less well considered offerings? Is permanently banning anyone a step too far? Returning to my characterization of fascism as “illiberal authoritarianism”, I think, after giving the matter due thought, I will plead not guilty. That is because my approach here may be authoritarian but the aim – if perhaps not always the effect – is liberal. Does that make sense? Am I getting this whole moderation thing right, or not? Do let me know what you think.
Don’t worry about your comments’ section. You do a good job of fostering debate (read: “massive arguments”) while somehow managing to keep (almost) everything civil. That’s impressive. Take a look at this video to see what your average comments’ section tends to devolve into: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QyYaPWasos
>Take a look at this video
Yep, the vid captures it! A few folks here have tried the “you’re an asshole” approach but they don’t last even though I try not to be heavy-handed. I like to think there’s room for genuine passion and anger if the writer has taken the trouble to make a coherent point and refrains from personal insults.
“I think I do have some ground, on which to understand what you’re talking about…even if my own private ventures, will likely always remain modest in comparison to yours [and many others].”
You are too modest! Thanks for your support here and for all your valuable work on blogs, etc.
it’s unfortunate…
Some people will get extremely abusive…and I’m glad to see others of some standing, acknowledging that yes…we do have amongst our wider ranks, people with some extreme personal problems…who can become very difficult to associate with.
…I’m confident that a lot of this has to do with being habitually maltreated, the many ways that we so typically are by the wider culture…
…But at the same time, while some people may need a target for their anger…I’ve always felt, that “we” need to be better than that, to each other…Because virtually nobody else will be, and their is a scare supply of support as it is…We shouldn’t be feeding upon breaking down each other.
Having had several websites/blogs, and having moderated at a few forums [including BoyChat]…I think I do have some ground, on which to understand what you’re talking about…even if my own private ventures, will likely always remain modest in comparison to yours [and many others].
What I’ve personally always striven towards, is an environment that is reasonably inviting…and engaging…Which means, people being intentionally disruptive are shown the door, at my own discretion.
From what I’ve seen, you seem to balance things well here.
Of course I don’t know you, and I fear it would be presumptuous of me to say anything at all about your character, but might I say I find it difficult to believe that anyone would ever accuse you of being a poor writer.
I have nothing at all to add about anything else, except that if I have done anything to cause any offence I do beg your pardon. We know not what we do most of the time, and the rest of the time we’re far too drunk to remember.
[TOC adds: Thanks, Kit. No, you have done absolutely nothing to cause offence, unless I was too drunk to notice!]
One other thing. Tom has been excellent therapy for me.
TOC adds: And you for me! This sort of response sure helps make up for the hail of insults from elsewhere!
I would just like to thank everyone for the posts sent so far on this topic. Overwhelmingly, they amount to a very gratifying vote of confidence, so I propose to carry on much as I have been doing. However, I still feel uncomfortable about banning posts from any particular individual on an indefinite basis.
I think the best policy may be the one I adopted with the “virtuous” paedophiles.I ran a couple of blogs about them, and it made sense to allow their response, not just in terms of fairness, which is important in itself, but also because the debate would have been much the poorer without all sides having vigorous representation. I soon had to tell them where to get off, though: offered an inch (well, a good many inches, actually), they were more than ready to take a mile through irksomely repetitious and information-free “contributions” that smacked more of point-scoring and time-wasting then worthwhile debate. So I told them it was Game Over. However, I did not say “Never darken my doorstep again”. I said come back, if you wish, when you have something new and substantial to offer.
This ought in theory to be a sustainable position in relation to all problematic contributors. In practice I have found my time and energy sapped by taking time out to give people reasoned explanations for my particular editorial decisions. That must stop. If a post is trashed the sender will just have to work out the reasons for himself, or try another tack in a different post, or just go elsewhere.
Dominant discourse? More like absolutist mania. We have a woman called Professor Frieda Briggs in Australia and she says that she has come across sex-offenders as young as four! How can anyone holding the title Professor be so utterly foolish?
But this mind-set illustrates the current discourse better than anything my feeble brain could think up. How does Briggs imagine those four-year-olds commit their crimes? Bribing three-year-olds with ice-cream? And — what evil people they must be — those ruthless four-year-olds!
Scholarbones.
Nothing much to add to the excellent positive comments here, but as you are keen for feedback I will just say: This is a nice place to visit. Keep up the good work our kid!
Boychat is not really a space I visit very often, I am much more likely to visit this site and Clover News.
I have stated above my rather simple and straight-forward support for open discusion of a sexuality I currently refer to as minor attractedness.
Tom, in your reply to David R. you use the kinds of vocabulary I often use as well, reference to dominant discourses and so forth. My interests are sociological, philosophic, and theological/religious in flavour. I have my own website, as do a number of people who come here. (http://takearisknz.wordpress.com)
I am curious, regarding the kind of post I think both Tom and I put up on our webstes, how can we do better what is already being done? Socially and culturally the dominant discourses are so damaging and in my view so unhelpful, my objective is to resist their character and contribute to a very different conversation. That is why, as I have said above, I think your site Tom does that job well.
Having been the target of “obsessively demanding bitchiness” in a private email from one of the participants in this blog ( I was told that I needed to “correct” some of my views; they were obviously erroneous since they were not in agreement with those of the writer), I would say that you show a lot of forbearance to respondents.
But if you want to see an example of minimal moderating, pop over to BoyChat ( http://www.boychat.org/ ). It has been said that one may find there “many different viewpoints and approaches, from the shock jocks and the disgusting and nauseating, the boorish and belligerent, through the frivolous, bland, and humorous to the friendly, civil, rational, supportive, and – occasionally – instructive and even profound.” Unfortunately, the preponderance of participants seems to lean toward the first groups, with far fewer being in the last groups. The board has been around most of the time since 1997, but the net result of the loose moderation is that there is little – albeit occasionally some – constructive discussion.
From 1998 through 2005 I was the principal moderator of “SafeHaven” ( http://www.shfri.net/safetnet/sh/index.html ), which was, like Heretic TOC, an attempt to foster civil discussion of sexually expressed boy/older male relationships. It was under constant attack, and was referred to by some on BoyChat as “Nazi Chat” because guest posts had to be pre-approved. It finally fizzled out from lack of participation.
The shortage of community and cohesiveness seems to be the bane of hope for progress in the cause of the understanding and acceptance of the rights of boys to their own sexuality and the rights of older males to cooperate with those seeking boys. Some of it seems to be simple egotism and/or “professional jealousy;” it filtered back to me that the 2001 Androphilia paper ( http://www.boyandro.info ) was referred to by a well known former friend/associate of mine as “comedic,” and that he was doing me a favor by refraining from submitting the comments that the editor of IJSH requested. We are too few to waste our energy on internal bickering, but I guess this has gone on since the days of Brongersma and Bernard. Sad indeed….
Moderating HTOC will not always be pleasant and/or easy, Tom. As one who has been through this in one form or another for over 15 years, I can only counsel that you stick to the subject and avoid going off on marginally relevant tangents, ignore the outright flames, use your best judgment, and let the chips fall where they may. I am an eternal optimist; I think the depathologization of masturbation and homosexuality will eventually be repeated for boy love. Perhaps not in my lifetime, but eventually. I hope that HTOC continues to contribute toward that anticipation, and that I may also make some small contribution.
Thanks Dave, for bringing your own moderating experience to this discussion, for the informative comparison with Boychat, and of course for your support.
You say “I can only counsel that you stick to the subject and avoid going off on marginally relevant tangents, ignore the outright flames, use your best judgment, and let the chips fall where they may.”
I suspect we may not always agree on what is relevant to the “discourse of resistance” that is promised here in the About page. Sometimes it will be resistance to “the dominant narrative” in relation to “children’s sexual self-determination and paedophilia”, as announced. However, as I also say in the About page, “Heretic TOC is my personal blog”. Accordingly, it is my personal discourse of resistance rather than the fulfilment of a specified political or philosophical agenda. I think it is inevitable that every reader will find some blogs more relevant to their own concerns than others; and readers can be expected to have widely varying views among themselves as to what is relevant. If I stray too far from what people find interesting and significant, I guess will soon find out through readers drifting away. Then I will have to choose whether I want to be a prophet in the wilderness preaching only to the desert sands! Or I could just pay attention to readers’ advice!
If you are going to have a worthwhile discussion you have to prune it at least to some extent. I think most people would agree, for example, that flames do not in any way further discussion. The difficult question, of course, concerns posts that are not flames but that are objectionable in other ways. Perhaps focusing on the purpose of the site would be useful here. It is to further in-depth dialogue, if I understand it. If that is true then I think in addition to flames, tow other kinds of comments might be pruned out. First, those that attack people rather than ideas. Second, those that are simply mindless – that have no thought content at all. If I thought you were pruning comments simply because they expressed ideas that were unpopular on our site, I would probably go elsewhere. But I see no evidence you are doing this.
P.S. It is, after all, a PRIVATE garden but one which the world can enjoy.
Hello David,
Are you David from B4U ACT and formerly NAMBLA? I’ve been missing you.
No, you are not being a fascist nor am I appalled by your perfectly reasonable observations or actions. Nor are you being authoritarian as you are not imposing constraints on others to express their own vile or unhinged views since they are perfectly free to get their own WordPress account and have at it.
Because of that, it is not an issue of censorship but the exercise of property rights, something which much of the left never quite seems to grasp.
If anything, the mistake is in not fully separating or distinguishing the actions of a private individual exercising his rights from those of governments abridging the rights of its citizens to speak and to be heard. These are fundamentally different relationships and your obligations are not those of our governments.
I share your concern about the number of such badly damaged individuals with whom we seem to share a subculture. It is a very sobering reality and one which poses an array of disturbing, if unanswerable, questions.
Meanwhile, I would urge you to continue tending your garden – a lovely one, at that – through the relentless and diligent pruning and weeding that typifies the archetypal and matronly English gardener who knows how to grow a rose and who shows no sentiment for weeds or snails or the odd branch that grows at such an angle that it simply “won’t do”.
In the short time where I have come to your site, read your posts and other people’s comments, the process seems positive. I view you as entitled, as are all those who have blog-sites, to moderate them as you choose.
What I do find positive, and I see this less as a function of your site and more a process connected to your life history, those who are interested in debate and information, can come to this blog and gain some benefit.
Hope the negative stuff does not undermine that process.
Dear Tom, you are certainly NOT immoderate! Keep up the excellent work!
M T-W.
The only relevant point to be made here is, given your desire to have sex with boys, and given your obsessively demanding bitchiness (I wouldn’t call it authoritarian, merely tedious) and lack of any form of humour or good grace, whether I as a parent would allow you near mine.
Out here in Australia, mate, you’d be told by a lot of people to piss off, go fuck yourself, come near our kids and you’ll get your head smashed in.
I say that only because I live here and I know the situation, yet you refuse to consider the reality, demanding rather that everyone be nice to you and allow you to do what you want.
Sorry, it’s just not going to happen.
Gil, if you don’t like it here, there are other web sites you can frequent. Is Tom being unreasonable? I don’t think so. I am one of the people he has felt it necessary to correct. When I read his comments I thought he was being fair enough.
TOC adds: Thank you, adamjohn2. I should say immediately that whatever I have “corrected” in your case (I’m afraid I cannot recall) I am sure it was not a lack of courtesy. You are very pleasant and reasonable.