The little murderer in Adolescence, a 13-year-old boy, is drop-dead gorgeous. Absolutely to die for!
Not that his victim thought so. A school classmate, she had spurned his faltering efforts at dating her (“I’m not that desperate”, she told him). Nor is he impressed with his own looks (“I’m ugly”). Humiliated, feeling he will never make it with girls, he confronts her in a carpark. CCTV footage captures him in what seems to be an angry verbal tirade before we see a knife in his hand. He stabs her again and again, killing her in an “incel” fury.

The searing emotional impact and crackling dramatic tension of this four-part Netflix series undoubtedly justifies the numerous rave reviews. But there were a few critics. Some complained that all the attention was on the perpetrator, none on the victim, emphasising his humanity and suffering at the expense of hers. Others protested that the narrative simplistically put all the blame on social media and misogynist influencers such as Andrew Tate.
A more compelling question for Heretic TOC, though, is why this series has been invested with such huge importance, treated by numerous commentators, including Keir Starmer, as though it were a fact-based drama, almost a documentary, like that other big hit, Mr Bates vs the Post Office. The answer, I suggest, bears a surprisingly strong connection to my opening remark about the boy’s attractiveness. Only a shameless nonce like me would talk openly about fancying him, but millions of viewers will also have been influenced, consciously or otherwise, by his angelic appearance.
I am reminded of Alan Kurdi. The name may not mean anything to you now, but if you were following the news ten years ago you will probably recall a harrowing photo of a two-year-old Syrian toddler pictured dead on a Mediterranean beach. He had drowned along with his mother and brother. They had all been trying to reach Europe in a dangerous boat crossing as refugees from the civil war in their country in 2015. The tragic fate of little Alan, whose family had been among thousands of others fleeing a desperate situation, caught the imagination of the western public and media like nothing else.
The media at the time had been largely hostile to these refugees, who were seen as an invading horde, an impersonal mass of foreigners threatening to overwhelm our communities and either live off state benefits or steal our jobs. But just one single image of one dead child suddenly cut through all that. Alan was too real to ignore. Indisputably an innocent victim, he was also a highly relatable one. Looking well-dressed and cared for, he could have been the much-loved pride and joy of any western parent.
Bluntly, he also looked like a white boy – neither too black nor too poor to be seen as Other, which would have dulled our emotional response because, rightly or wrongly, we do tend to feel charity begins (and perhaps even ends) at home, with our own tribe, our kith and kin. It is a sentiment JD Vance tried to justify recently by citing the Catholic theology of Ordo amoris (order of love), only to be put in his place by Cardinal Robert Prevost, now Pope Leo XIV, who told him firmly he was wrong.
It will not have escaped the attention of those who saw Adolescence that the young killer, “Jamie”, is white. That alone, for most British viewers, will have said he is “one of us”. As such, he is seen not as a monster but as just a vulnerable child with emotional problems crying out to be addressed with sympathy and understanding, an impression reinforced by his physical slightness.
Played with extraordinary conviction by Owen Cooper, who looks much younger than his 15 years, Jamie lacks for nothing in terms of loving parental support. The drama focuses mainly on his father, “Eddie Miller”, being put through the wringer of emotional trauma. Dad is the one tasked with going to the police station to be with Jamie as he is taken through the evidence against him. He sees the damning CCTV footage but is desperate to accept his son’s claim it has been faked. Eddie doesn’t tell Mum what he has seen, shielding his wife but leaving the full weight of the awful reality on his own shoulders, a reality that sees him agonised through a grim sequence of classic trauma reactions, starting with denial and progressing through anger, depression and grief over the blighted life that will inevitably be his son’s future as a convicted murderer. Stephen Graham as Eddie, does surely award-winning justice to a demanding role.

A recurring theme in the Comments at Heretic TOC recently has been whether subjects are off-topic for this forum if they have only a remote connection to youth liberation or MAP concerns. Adolescence is obviously on-topic, but the question of Jamie’s whiteness and its implications quickly takes us much wider, onto less sure terrain. In my keenness to avoid the negative side of identity politics, in which white is set against black, males against females (BLs against GLs is also not unknown), I have tended to downplay “intersectionality”, which can all too easily degenerate into competitive victimhood, with those who claim to have been sexually abused at the very top of the hierarchy, even when they lie about it – which they do because the rewards are so great, especially for showbiz people who need a “better” backstory.
Nevertheless, studying how the intersections of race, religion, gender, etc., affect politics and history remains an important analytic tool for interpreting our world. Our understanding of the potential for youth liberation or oppression is diminished if we ignore it. I was reminded of this when I read (thanks to a link given in the Comments here) Brian Ribbon’s powerful cry of outrage in his article for Mu on the horrific situation in Gaza, especially the suffering of children there, including those far too young to be combatants.
Brian rightly directs much of his ire against American hypocrisy. It is a country that wages war on paedophiles in the name of protecting children, he says, but disregards children’s wellbeing “in the countries whose merciless destruction it actively funds and foments”, including Palestine. This, he believes, is “essentially the result of a racist and imperialist mindset, deeply entrenched in the belief that brown lives are worth less and are more expendable”.
I could not agree more with his attack on the policies of the extremist Israeli government, which in the opinion of humanitarian agencies and leading human rights lawyers have already involved numerous war crimes and could even be classed as genocidal. Even former Israeli prime minister Ehud Olmert, in a BBC interview this week, called Netanyahu’s government a bunch of thugs. Those who blame everything on the admittedly horrific and also criminal 7 October 2023 raid led by Hamas, with its hostage-taking and atrocities against civilians, need to be aware that the situation did not start on that date. For those who feel the need for a quick briefing on the deeper background, I recommend A Very Short History of the Israel-Palestine Conflict by Ilan Pappé, who believes the Palestinian cause is just, despite being Jewish himself. He was a senior lecturer in history at the University of Haifa, Israel, for over 20 years. As such, he can hardly be dismissed as a biased Hamas militant, or an Islamist.
That said, to reduce a very complex situation simplistically to any single dimension, in this case to the racial one, of “brownness” and “whiteness”, is to distort reality in favour of propaganda. As an analytical tool, intersectionality is meaningfully and usefully deployed when all the relevant intersections are considered, from culture to commerce and gender to geography, taking us through and beyond the more commonly theorised dimensions (gender, race, social class) of privilege and victimhood.
Brian’s article hints at this necessary complexity when he turns to America’s propensity for violence, including the mass murder even of white children. Nineteen young kids, most of them aged 10, and two teachers, were massacred almost exactly three years ago, in May 2022, at Robb Elementary School, Uvalde, Texas, gunned down by a teenage former student at the school. The most politically significant aspect of this catastrophe is not the hateful behaviour of the lone killer himself. As with the Sandy Hook school massacre that I blogged about years ago, and many others, the key point is the national lack of will to make sure such violence never happens again. All that “kick ass America”, as I called it, ever does is shrug its shoulders and parrot platitudes such as “Guns don’t kill people, people do”. As Brian pointed out, guns are still said to be necessary to prevent tyranny, yet the very political forces claiming to defend this ideal have facilitated the birth of Trump’s tyrannical regime.
We might add that it is gun-toting “kick ass” cultures that give disaffected young men and teenage boys not only the firepower to go on the rampage but also, crucially, the attitude: resort to violence by individuals is legitimated and even glamorised in cultures where everyone plays hardball and Might Is Right.
Which brings me back home to Britain and to our fictional – but all too plausible – young murderer in Adolescence. Jamie used a knife not a gun, and his anger was directed against just one victim, not many. But his mindset was arguably not so different to that of a mass killer. As an incel, his resentment was against all women for their imagined lack of any possible interest in him.
Not that there was anything inevitable about this. Beliefs are formed and reinforced in social contexts, which vary with time and place. Just as violence comes more easily in a hardball culture, so does resentment against even supposedly liberal values when they go sour, degenerating, as they regrettably have done on both sides of the Atlantic, from the progressive and noble task of enhancing the wellbeing and prospects of oppressed minorities – through “diversity, equity, and inclusion” (DEI) – towards new forms of tyranny in which the formerly oppressed classes themselves become the oppressors, the classic case being feminism.
I have always regarded myself, and remain to this day, an equal-opportunities feminist. Women around the world have earned great and well justified successes in their struggle against male dominance and patriarchal oppression. But their triumph has been so spectacularly successful it is now (in the US and UK at least) the males who are downtrodden. This extends, of course, to the oppression of MAPs, but it does not stop with us. It’s a ball-crusher for normies, too. The rules of consent have become so extensive, elaborate, and bureaucratised that many guys simply give up on romance and love, resorting instead to the shallower but far less perilous satisfactions of porn.
This is the context that gives credibility to Jamie’s despairing conclusion that he will always be a loser in love: he is bound to be a loser not just because he thinks he is ugly but because the male winners in modern society are few and getting fewer, as today’s picky women keep swiping left. Ironically, feminists have long accused men of treating them as objects, not people, but now it is the guys who fall victim to casual “objectification” by women.

We see a version of this in the third episode of Adolescence, when Jamie is interviewed by a female forensic psychologist, “Briony Ariston”, who is tasked with producing a pre-trial report on his mental capacity. Her professional standards require her to be objective, and in order to maintain that objectivity, she must not let her own personal feelings and opinions intrude on the interview, as this could influence and distort the interviewee’s response to questions. So, she must be as calm and poker-faced as possible. Officially, this objectivity is a million miles from “objectifying” anyone in a demeaning way. When you objectify someone, you are not really interested in them as a person. But from a professional standpoint, at least, Briony could hardly be more intensely interested in Jamie’s personality.
Jamie, however, takes a dim view of her detached attitude. It makes all her questions seem manipulative; and when, after telling her he believes he is ugly, it becomes inevitably offensive when she coldly refuses to contradict him. What really triggers him, though, sending him into a rage that derails and terminates the interview completely, is her response when he asks, “Do you like me? As a person, I mean. I don’t mean do you fancy me.” There is an awkward silence. Then a deadpan non-answer: “I am here in a professional capacity…”
Erin Doherty, as Briony, is fabulous in capturing the psychologist’s struggle to maintain her poise in the face of Jamie’s moodiness, swinging unpredictably as it does from childlike neediness to hot-tempered confrontation . After he is escorted away, we see her left alone in the empty interview room, forced to “take a moment”, the strain of her encounter etched on her face and audible in her breathing. She looks as though she could do with a stiff drink.
But that is not the face Jamie saw. To him she had been just another cold, indifferent, rejecting bitch.
KIDS INVITED TO PLAY NICELY
Four years ago, Everyone’s Invited, a charity that proclaims itself dedicated to “exposing and eradicating rape culture with empathy, compassion and understanding”, published a report on thousands of testimonies by mainly teenage girls disclosing sexual harassment they said they had suffered from school classmates. The alleged perpetrators had included boys at Britain’s poshest fee-paying schools. As might be expected, Heretic TOC duly commented, in “Everyone’s invited to reconsider childhood”.
A couple of months ago, the charity published a follow-up report, this time on primary schools, naming 1,664 schools in the UK where pupils had submitted anonymous testimonies of “rape culture”, detailing their experiences of “sexist name-calling, harassment, groping, inappropriate touching and penetration”. Innocent little kids, eh? Who’d have thought it! According to a report in The Times, “Their collective howl of pain is harrowing but this is the state of our children in 2025”.
If you want to know what I think, just read my earlier piece, linked above, because I do address the question of children’s introduction to sexual morals and manners from their early years onwards, and I believe what I said then still holds good now. My recommendation for a very early start to relationships education is echoed by the new report, and I find myself in agreement with at least some aspects of what Soma Sara, founder and CEO of Everyone’s Invited, has said, which includes a constructive comment on Adolescence. As her interviewer for a piece in The Times, put it:
The Netflix series Adolescence, which follows a young boy arrested for killing his female classmate, has been very helpful, she [Soma Sara] believes, in showing how every child is vulnerable, including those with loving parents. “This is a collective burden. There is one scene where the kid who has committed the atrocity is screaming to the therapist, ‘But do you like me’. I thought, that is it. Young men want to be seen and appreciated, not viewed as the problem the whole time. Girls had centuries of not being encouraged but now boys feel the same. We need to help them all.”
Where I part company from Sara and others who see “rape culture” everywhere is their tendency to see sexual expression itself as negative, especially among the young. The real problem, to the extent that there is one, is not sex per se but the lack of opportunity kids have for actually having sex from an early age. They need the chance to actually be doing it, before frustration starts making it harder to start with relaxed good manners – manners that can and should be taught from nursery school/kindergarten onwards.
BEEB BACKS BAD-BOY ARTIST ERIC GILL
A rare bit of good news from last month: the vandalised work of a famous MAP sculptor has been restored and gone back on display at one of London’s most prominent and prestigious locations, despite a campaign to have the piece removed and its creator “cancelled”.
There is little I need add. The Guardian’s report, the start of which is reproduced below, gives all the key details. So, enjoy!

The following is the start of the news report in The Guardian by media editor Michael Savage. The full article also includes a photo of the wider facade of Broadcasting House, giving a good idea of the statue’s prominent position:
A controversial sculpture outside the BBC’s London headquarters has been put back on display behind a protective screen after being restored, with the corporation saying it in no way condoned the “abusive behaviour” of its creator.
The work by Eric Gill, which depicts Prospero and Ariel from William Shakespeare’s The Tempest, had been largely out of view since it was vandalised with a hammer in 2022. There have long been calls for Gill’s works to be removed since his diaries revealed he had sexually abused his two eldest daughters.
The BBC said it had taken advice before restoring the sculpture that adorns Broadcasting House, while visitors can now scan a QR code near the building to understand the dark background of the sculpture’s creator.
Gill’s statue was carved on-site for Broadcasting House in 1931 and 1932, underlining his status as one of the most prominent sculptors of the early 20th century. However, private diaries published several decades after his death in 1940 revealed his history of sexual abuse.
As well as the abuse of his daughters, they also documented sexual activity with the family dog. His statues, particularly his Broadcasting House work, have become a focus of attention for the hard right, including Tommy Robinson and the conspiracy group QAnon.
Broadcasting House is a Grade II* listed building, meaning it is of special interest. The cost of restoration and protective work was just over £500,000. “Broadcasting House is a building of historical and cultural significance and has been so for almost a century,” a BBC spokesperson said. “The sculpture of Ariel and Prospero – depicted as symbols of broadcasting – is an integral part of it.”
Ex-HOT Loli Jodie Foster
Being gay is like being left-handed—some people are, most people aren’t, and nobody really knows exactly why. It’s not right or wrong; it’s just one of the many natural ways to be. The world works best when everyone gets to live as they truly are. So if you ever feel out of place, remember: you’re not broken, you’re just beautifully different—and that’s something the world needs.
*Jodie Foster*
Love love love That’s all xxxxxxx
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=1237589104405996&set=a.231412605023656
Here are some Latin news from Luxembourg media.
Thanks, Cyril. You have found some interesting and important items. I would just point out that the correct link for the second item (Luxembourg Feminists) is as follows: https://www.cnfl.lu/files/120874.pdf
The link you gave starts with an invalid Chrome Extension element.
They will not understand that their actions will lead to what they are supposedly fighting against. Restricting pornography will lead to an increase moral panic and accusations of abuse/rape, which will further increase misandry.
The Bastien Vives link in English translation.
Another article on the topic from Le Monde, where the editor in chief deplores “an Era which is blurring the line between reality and fiction.”
Can you believe we live in a world where people are prosecuted for drawings? I wonder if we’ll start prosecuting the owners of Fanny Hill novels again, since they depict young maidens, or “child prostitutes,” having sex?
Everyone except perhaps the way too sheltered, middle-class prudes, knows that viewing porn or playing violent video games doesn’t make you rape kids or pick up a gun. But, it’s not about protecting kids. It’s about policing desire. Figuring out if you’re a certain kind of person.
The case of Bastien shows it very clearly. His 1st legal battle stayed in the realm of art so he was aquitted. But his 2nd, was handled by “child protection” specialists who focused on him as a person. Asking him what he masturbates to, cross referencing his DNA with sex offence databases.
His art wasn’t on trial, his desire was…
By 2050 when angry Gen Selfie-SeXt grows up, there’ll be body-proud MANDATORY MUTUAL MASTURBATION CLASSES from Age 4 – HOT for Teacher streamed ‘Live’ Worldwide.
Figures disclosed by 27 police forces in England and Wales revealed 306 cases of children under 10, including some as young as four, being investigated on suspicion of taking or sharing indecent images of themselves or other minors since 2017.
https://www.theguardian.com/society/2019/dec/30/thousands-of-children-under-14-have-been-investigated-by-police-for-sexting
Tom, be cool with me. Some of my comments are reasonable but not being published by you.
I keep it clean and logical. For me, you know I don’t like perversion, but I love the idea of clean child sex.
At the very least, give me a brief email explaining why you don’t publish something.
Zen, some of your more recent posts appear to be just attention-seeking provocations, lacking substance or general interest. You are smart enough to know what I mean.
Top lawyer ‘preyed on young women entering law’ (Jun 5, 2025)
Channel 4 News report, featuring Harriet Harman who’s writing a report on the subject.
This report has everything. “Grooming” used not to refer to minors or ‘children’, but to young women. “Power dynamics,” “other victims,” “misogyny,” “a older man in a position of power.” Staying silent about apparently feeling “pressured,” but only realizing how bad this all apparently was “years later.” It’s like victimology bingo! Even twerking gets a mention!
The man in question is Jo Sidhu KC, who has recently had a host of charges against him dropped, with a tribunal calling the twerking message allegation an “unwise” decision, but “not seriously reprehensible.” I’d extend that to everything in Channel 4’s report. These were women in their 20s who, if they cannot say no to consensual sex, should not be having sex of any kind with anyone!
Abstracted, the report signals to older men: “stay away from young women.” In other words, age apartheid.
There’s also a strange, underlying injunction towards monogamy. An implicit stigma around an older, wealthy man seeking sexual relations with many (young) women, despite the fact that many men seek wealth and status precisely in order to be attractive to women. No wonder young men are confused!
It’s a fascinating watch, and one that so obviously shows why liberal progressive types will keep losing. I refer readers to Echo Chamberlin vids I posted below, who makes various points about the need to appeal to men far better than I can articulate.
#MaketheLeftMasculineAgain
Why The LGBT Movement Is Failing (May 31, 2025) – This video, by Think Before You Sleep, has blown up recently.
The extremely popular right-wing gaming-cum-politics YouTuber Asmongold reaction video has reached 1.6 million views so far, sure to grow a bit in days to come. Other channels have followed, making their own “react content.”
For balance and a dissenting, pro-trans voice, check out Suris’ response here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2M_j9lr7Krw
I think people here will like the Youtube channel Echo Chamberlin. Many videos of relevance to recent topics covered on this blog. A very thoughtful channel that represents the male experience well, imo. He also makes some fantastic points when talking about the modern publishing industry.
His video on Netflix’s Adolescence: In Defence Of Boys: Challenging Modern Narratives (Apr 14, 2025)
Trans Ideology Has Collapsed (Apr 21, 2025)
10 Hard Truths For Liberals – From A Liberal (Dec 12, 2024)
The Female Dominance Of Fiction Has Become Ridiculous (Oct 28, 2024)
Solid logic lil Loli, “Mama, why is the letter W in the alphabet called double U – shouldn’t it called double V?
https://www.facebook.com/reel/643146331633018
HOT Lolis know – the fuckit list – stay weird.
https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid=736527548799858&set=a.110064944779458
What lil Kung foo that?!
https://www.facebook.com/reel/1402022354153295
I have a strong suspicion that most HTOC readers access this platform through Tor, and are unlikely to copy or follow Facebook links.
It might be better to post news articles or other, more accessible links to sites that don’t require an account to view. (Many facebook posts require login to view).
A suggestion…
Your Facebook reel could be viewed publicly, but the image you shared not.
Thanx Prof Prue. Pup’s not on, or can’t access, some forums but F.B. & YT seem to be most popular?
Fair enough! And lol, “Prof Prue,” I’ll say I’m an honorary professor of MAP studies! :p
HOT seat HOT Loli, Lydia Denton, a 12-year-old from North Carolina, invented the “Beat The Heat Car Seat” to help protect kids left in hot cars.
She got the idea after hearing stories of children accidentally left behind and wanted to prevent such accidents. Her smart seat uses a pressure pad to detect a child.
If the car reaches 102°F, it sounds an alarm, alerts the parent’s phone, and if there’s no response, it contacts emergency services with the car’s GPS location.
Lydia won a $20,000 prize from the CITGO Fueling Education Challenge and gained national attention.
https://www.facebook.com/watch?v=635874802603534
Of course the little 17 year old children must be protected from smoke in cars. But ironically they can drive the damn things
… Amother stupid law by uk government
“INCELERANDO” – 26 Nov. 2021 by Dr Rookh Kshatriya (Author)
North America, 2068: a violent Wild West world where society has disintegrated into competing cultic fiefdoms in the wake of the Great Fall, which brought technological society to an end thirty years before. The Internet is now a legend, as are automobiles and aeroplanes.
Into this strange land wanders an adventurer named Regens, last survivor of a genocide camp called Ascalon, inhumanly quick with an antique six-gun. He meets a preacher who has memorised the lost YouTube sermons of nihilistic prophets from the early 21st century. Slowly, Regens begins to learn the origins of his world from these fragmented folk-memories. As mass apathy and dissent weakened society, the authorities clamped down with camps run by genetically-enhanced women. After decades of repression and revolt, America emerged in a lawless and primitive state.
When they spring an outlaw from his lynching, Regens and the preacher are forced to flee into the Stranger Lands, a legendary place where remnants of the old technologies persist. There they are captured and brought to the land of SHEBA, an advanced FEMINIST UTOPIA. This hidden stronghold is part of the genocidal regime of old, and heir to its agendas. The Shebans tell Regens he is the product of a mysterious experiment and that his perilous journey across America was a test to determine his fitness for future tasks.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Incelerando-Dr-Rookh-Kshatriya/dp/B09M81LGQV/
Just round out sophia loren was dating 37 year old carlo ponti at 15. And quite legal in italia ! No mention of sex crimes or pedrophilia in the article. how refreshing ! Is this one in the consenting juveniles section of newgon ?
Sophia Loren was still attending school when she began dating Carlo Ponti. She was 15 when they met in 1950 and was pursuing an acting career while in school. Ponti, was 22 years older and already married at the time.
Today’s post-modern fake media Anglo Victorian tabloid negative headline, “DIRTY married Italian stallion GROOMED innocent pro-active schoolgirl VICTIM” (into a World famous female icon).
Rachel Brouwer, a young inventor from Bedford, Nova Scotia, started making a difference when she was just 11. She created a solar-powered device that purifies water using UV light and includes a clever soybean wax indicator that changes color when the water is safe to drink — a big step forward in low-cost clean water solutions.
Her idea won major awards, including gold at Canada’s national science fair and top honors at the International Science and Engineering Fair. She was even recognized with an asteroid named after her — a rare tribute for outstanding young scientists.
https://www.facebook.com/watch?v=695491510098174
Yes but imagine if she were able to date older men? That would mean an attractive 40 year old man who fell in love with Rachel for her intelligence and beauty would be unavailable to marry a fat old annoying 40 year old cow (the horror!). It would also mean other 40 year old men already married to fat old annoying 40 year old cows would feel extremely jealous. So, we must demand the government slanders and kills anyone over 18 who might want to fully love Rachel for her intelligence and beauty.
Sounds like a very healthy, sane civilization, that will surely produce generations of happy and productive people. Right.
The trick is to not be a “fat old annoying 40 year old cow,” and then men will want to date you. The same goes for men with women. Look after yourself, chill out, add to someone’s peace, and you’ll be fine.
Let’s not be too mean about older ladies; everyone has to age and an older woman can be very attractive.
Men tend to prefer younger women, and women tend to prefer slightly older men. There’s a kind of symbiosis, and yes it’s unfortunate that there’s a lot of pressure, shame and jealousy put upon age-gap relationships from weirdos on social media.
But fuck the weirdos. Admire the incredible talent of young people, and if you find them beautiful, great. You can’t date anyone underage legally speaking, but you can be friendly with people of all ages, make positive contributions to the lives of others, and have a great life.
Young people often have to start their adult lives far later than in earlier times. In many ways they might be held back by not being permitted a relationship with an older man or woman; someone who could offer them a whole new life, education and perspective on the world. Something that was once common in the gay community.
But, such is life.
The fear of sex and fear of men and male sexuality, is at the root of so much of these shaming tactics (and predator” discourse). It needs challenging big time, that’s for sure.
Men aren’t bears, they aren’t out to get you. They certainly don’t want to kill you. They may, at worst, want to have sexy time with you. And perhaps, if they really like you, love you, and even want to build a family. That’s not so bad, is it?
What is this? No one is saying it’s illegal to date a 40 year old fat old annoying cow of a woman, or a 40 year old woman that is somehow more attractive than a 15 year old woman. In fact, no one will say one word about it.
Everyone is saying it is illegal and evil for an older man to even attempt to date a 15 year old woman. There is no excuse for this, and there is no other explanation for this, other than blatant and cruel state feminism.
She looks about 13 in this Facebook post. Would be surprised if she was 11 in all those photos. She looks older imo; I’d be surprised if an 11-year-old female could do her makeup like that.
In my mind, I associate 11-year-olds as typically not caring much about such things, but I could be way off when it comes to the women. If they’re not bucking the trend and becoming a “gamer girl,” then the girls have a lot more time than the boys who often have their heads in the video games non-stop.
Perhaps, like some of these young ladies who’ve ostensibly created innovative technology at a very young age, they’re an old head on young shoulders. They’d certainly be the exception. Most youngsters at 11 seem obsessed with video games, porn, social dramas with their friends, or extracurricular clubs (dancing, art, etc.)
The oldest ,most successful, quite possibly most respected magazine in England has just published the following paragraph:
“Paedophiles are a real danger – more so than those jailed for offensive social media posts. Not only are they wandering around outside our takeaway food outlets, sports clubs, schools and churches befriending and grooming vulnerable children and parents; they might be sitting beside us on the sofa.”
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/is-chemically-castrating-sex-offenders-really-a-good-idea/?utm_medium=email&utm_source=CampaignMonitor_Editorial&utm_campaign=BOCH%20%2020250524%20%20House%20Ads%20%20AL+CID_61bc1e7bcf972a0d418421a254dbceb3
I have to take issue with WJT’s assessment of “The Spectator”. Many years have passed since any truly politically unbiased observer would think of referring to The Spectator as the most successful, or most respected magaazine in England, or any other nation of the UK for that matter. To my mind, the words “rotten, right wing rag” seem more appropriate!
>I have to take issue with WJT’s assessment of “The Spectator”.
The linked article from this magazine was very poor IMO: long on sensationalist opinion, short on either evidence or expertise. OTOH, the Speccy continues to have political clout. Note that the current editor, Michael Gove, is one of the most high-profile former government cabinet members. Also, the title was acquired last year by Paul Marshall, owner of UnHerd and major investor in GB News. While the link with GB News definitely puts The Spectator in a “rotten, right wing rag” stable, Marshall’s backing probably means it will remain influential.
I’ve hated Michael Gove for so long now. Pretty sure he’s the “we’re tired of hearing from experts guy” during the UK’s Brexit debates.
No, sorry Michael, I’d much rather hear from people who know than people who don’t! The people who’ve spent their lives becoming experts in a field, versus those who haven’t!
I despise him and everything he represents. He’s the embodiment of a slippery worm man. He behaves as a stereotypical politician, catering to what’s popular rather than what he truly believes.
He gives politicians everywhere a bad name…
>Pretty sure he’s the “we’re tired of hearing from experts guy” during the UK’s Brexit debates.
Yes, that’s right. Unfortunately, so was he. He reportedly said, “people in this country have had enough of experts”. The fact that a majority voted for Brexit suggests they had indeed tired of hearing from economists who were warning it would be bad for the economy. However, recent polling shows huge numbers have now become disenchanted with Brexit and may wish they had paid more attention to those expert warnings!
At the time, it was a populist remark by Gove aimed at tapping into the widespread belief that experts are all in the pay of elites and downplay the needs and wishes of ordinary people. As such, it probably helped the Brexit cause, but if Gove has any shame he will surely be embarrassed now by what he said. He tried to row back on it even at the time, once he started taking flak: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39102841
>The fact that a majority voted for Brexit suggests they had indeed tired of hearing from economists who were warning it would be bad for the economy. However, recent polling shows huge numbers have now become disenchanted with Brexit and may wish they had paid more attention to those expert warnings!
MAP scholars, more than most should know not to follow or swallow the fake media narrative on most issues – missing vital facts? From victim-MAPS, to Putin-provoked, to pure-Semite Palestinians persecuted in their own land by part-Semite European ZioNazis.
Fake DeMockracy UK has £1,000 fine for non-return of Census Forms (of control) every 10 years. But NO penalty for not voting in an Election or Referendum – DOH?! Low turnout fake-vote BrexShit had 13 million NON-voters, meaning that a 62% majority did NOT vote ‘Leave’. Same 62% majority ‘Remain’ as in sensible Scotland and Ulster.
Don’t get FOOLED again by the Farage money-mafia, “UKIP if U want to we’re staying Wide Awake!”
Ok Glenn it is this I have to ask you – exactly how does standing off and branding a hugely embedded and influential publication ‘right wing rag” (or really, however) benefits the MAP cause better than say, paying ten bucks a month to get in there and mix it up with a commentariat that surely must entail an order of intelligent lurkers more forthcoming than any other broadly comparable “rag”? Can you explain the superiority of that tactic for me?
Or do you have stand-off missiles in your possession, that require no actual grappling with the forces of political darkness whatsoever ?
Awesome Warbling – thanks for the link.
The article however is far from awesome – forced suppression of the sexual function may infringe upon civil liberties.
Maybe only if someone really wants to avoid prison?? It’s a poor price to pay but is it worth it? Sex is just so much a part of who we are.
And blokes that befriend little girls really aren’t a problem, and often not a threat. And parents…? Ffs come on, parents are responsible enough and old enough to make their own decisions.
Surely the perfect society is where men and little girls *can* have authentic social interactions that are safe and satisfying. And if society cannot cope with that, well fucking learn to deal with it.
It will be interesting to see whether the ethical standards of the British medical profession are higher than those of their Indonesian colleagues:
https://www.benarnews.org/english/news/indonesian/indonesia-rights-08272019153613.html
He forgot to mention how dangerous the young people these pedos are interested in can be…..
I’m confused – if it is truly about removing danger, why not strip the citizenship of any person convicted of “pedophilia”? Oh that’s right, because it’s about vindictive, jealous punishment of anyone who would dare to insult the sex-negative feminist hoax laws.
Victims in landmark child abuse trial ask why France doesn’t want to know
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cvg559zz3d8o
Merciless Anglo kids, not so rare.
The US has a high rate of juvenile delinquency and youth incarceration compared to other countries. North America has the highest regional rate of children in detention, while East Asia and the Pacific have the lowest.
‘A child is going to lose their life’: Sickening trend of children filming attacks on other kids
https://news.sky.com/story/a-child-is-going-to-lose-their-life-sickening-trend-of-children-filming-attacks-on-other-kids-12866916
‘Children as young as five attacking their teachers’
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2025/03/30/surge-five-year-olds-kicked-out-school-attacking-teachers/
Teacher jeremy forrest just seen on facebook kissing someone 15 years younger than him (in her late 20s) people going mad. yes he did see a 15 year old a few years back, but it seems she did the chasing. im going mad too about these judgmental retards
Cant he sue the stinking Sun for invasion of privacy??
The ANGLOBITCH Thesis contends that the brand of feminism that arose in the Anglosphere (the English-speaking world) in the 1960s has an ulterior misandrist (anti-male) agenda quite distinct from its self-proclaimed role as ‘liberator’ of women.
http://kshatriya-anglobitch.blogspot.com/
“Havok” represents a piercing critical examination of the contradictions within Anglo-American Feminism. Rookh Kshatriya Author House, 25 Sep 2012 – 282 pages
https://books.google.be/books/about/Havok.html?id=-fId-x20zzEC&redir_esc=y
Nice article Tom, thanks.
“The rules of consent have become so extensive, elaborate, and bureaucratised that many guys simply give up on romance and love, resorting instead to the shallower but far less perilous satisfactions of porn.”
…and of course now feminists and their cuck conservative tyrant collaborators are banning all porn. USA, a country full of weak sycophant men competing over who can please the fat old pussy the most, actually is the opposite of kick ass, more like sexually frustrated little babies with guns.
“he is bound to be a loser not just because he thinks he is ugly but because the male winners in modern society are few and getting fewer, as today’s picky women keep swiping left.”
I would like to remind everyone, including incels, that there can be no female winners in society without cuck males who enable them. The moment cucks are shamed and slapped around to the point they refuse to help empower psychotic cruel feminism, is the moment feminist power collapses. Let’s start with F*CK THE POLICE, since the police are busy enforcing sex negative insane feminist laws.
You sound angry. There are probably many reasons to be angry.
You made me think that in Europe I see many adult men buying (or at least not opposing) discourses about the restriction of minors’ sexual freedom in the name of the protection. It sounds to me like they accept that discourse in exchange of securing their own freedom. Like “okay, forbid teens the porn but don’t bother us, the adults“.
However, this will NOT work in the long term. Nah nah. Don’t be naive! A system where porn is fatal for teens and innocuous for adults cannot be sustained. That doesn’t make any sense. So I foresee that most of this repressor movement will push laws and policies to forbid porn for adults too. The prohibitions will come in installments.
Attractive yet alienated youth. An Anglo thing for the gobsmacked masses i.e. ‘Popcorn Fodder’.
From pretty boy Dean ‘Rebel Without a Cause’ 1955, to pretty boy Cliff ‘Serious Charge’.1960, to real life Mary pixie-cute KILLER, 1968.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Bell
Kids killing others, 90% Anglos.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_youngest_killers
Than WP list in your second link is very interesting Pup. It certainly addresses scepticism expressed here over the plausibility of murder committed by a boy (or indeed girl) aged 13 or younger, even if such cases are mercifully rare.
’Adolescence’ seems to be purely about titillation. Jamie is way too old for me, I don’t like to go past about ten with boys, and boys for me have to be a 10/10 (you know I’m GL).
An adolescent boy as a troubled incel is a bit of a daft theme and somewhat distorts the reality of sexual politics, whether among adolescents, or for that matter among children or adults.
Lads and girls get on really well in schools. Respect breaks down when lads are too cheeky, or girls are too loose, but there’s a general cohesion in secondaries which holds the school population together. Non-sexual bullying is a different matter, of course.
So I think the point of ‘Adolescence’ is to be a work of fantasy fiction, something that allows psychological refractions and spin-offs into real world topics, but which on the face of it is silly and slightly socially destructive in perpetuating harmful stereotypes about boys. Certainly an anti-male drama, but this doesn’t disturb me.
What disturbs me is boys being foisted with the mantle of reverse victims (by ‘reverse victim’ I mean a perpetrator of a wrong who becomes a tragic figure himself).
Is that a healthy characterisation of boys? Absolutely not. I want boys to be portrayed as friendly, responsible and hardworking, as a basic requirement and reflection of social justice.
Best not to judge on the basis of reviews – even mine! 🙂 If you see it for yourself I doubt you’ll think it is “silly”.
Eric Gill surely discredits the MAP movement? He was violently abusive with his daughters. We cannot make someone a MAP icon if they perpetrate cruel violence against children.
There will always be posthumous attempts to discredit people but I don’t know of any evidence for doing so in Gill’s case. I’ve read Fiona McCarthy’s acclaimed 1989 biography of the guy and she didn’t cite any violence. Any claims of “violence” are likely to be coming from the #MeToo era, in which any paedophilic contacts are defined as violent, thus defining out of existence any acts in which a child was a voluntary participant.
Gill’s daughter Petra Tegetmeier, who was alive at the time of the MacCarthy biography, described her father as having “endless curiosity about sex” and that “we just took it for granted”, and told her friend Patrick Nuttgens she was unembarrassed. The children were educated at home and, according to Tegetmeier, she was then unaware of how her father’s behaviour would seem to others. (Patrick Nuttgens, The Guardian, 6 January 1999).
It might benefit you to be more skeptical around the media’s portrayal of MAPs. “Don’t believe everything you read,” and all those old sayings.
The discourse of “abuse” and “violence” (or “sexual violence”), is often used as a way to negatively render non-normative sexual contact which transgresses age of consent statutes, in this case involving historic figures when thinking around age and sex was very different.
The media and popular discourse, either having no sympathy for what they see as “nonces” and “pedos” who they’d happily have aborted as fetuses if it were possible, or being more privately sympathetic and reasonable but unwilling to risk pushback, very rarely represent MAPs or age gap sexy time in a fair way.
Often, they discount, deny, overwrite or just ignore how the younger partner feels, especially in historic cases before the frameworks of “abuse” and “trauma” became the predominant and permitted way to interpret all unlawful age-gap sexy time. As one of Gill’s daughters commented to the press:
“I don’t think it harmed me at all… We were all very fond of my father… We were old enough to say if we didn’t want to go along with him” (Billen, 1992).
https://wiki.yesmap.net/wiki/Eric_Gill
During my research about Gill, I could find nothing to substantiate that he was ever particularly “violent,” unless you consider any act of age gap sex or bestiality to be acts of violence in themselves, which I do not.
Punch a child or strangle a dog to get them to submit to sex, that’s violence! Some of the worst kind that most of us could imagine… There’s no suggestion that Gill did anything even close to that…
Hmmm so you mean like: ‘make my pussy bleed, daddy’. I get disturbed by that sort of thing, that’s all I’m saying.
Can I judge two willing parties? Not really.
In fairness to you, the media using terms like “abuse” aren’t particularly helpful, since it leaves us with no idea of what sexual contact took place. This has been a common criticism in research. So far, it’s often been implicitly assumed that sexual contact goes from less to more ‘severe,’ with things like kissing or masturbation on the less severe end, and intercourse the most.
In Gill’s case, I’ve seen nothing to suggest that we’re talking about intercourse / penetration, and nothing that could reasonably lead to bleeding. If Gill were into whips ‘n’ tassels, I’m sure the media wouldn’t shut up about it!
Intercourse with young children is rare full stop, especially of a mutually willing kind that Gill – if he did – would’ve sought to engage in. It’s much more likely that we’re talking about masturbation, oral sex: things that are often seen as more playful, less “serious,” or at risk of injury / being disliked by the recipient (since for humans penetration can and often does hurt in the beginning).
The Fiona McCarthy biography was annoying to read and I didn’t find specifics at the time, and haven’t seen any specifics in the news. I’m happy to be shown otherwise, but as it stands I doubt that ‘make my pussy bleed, daddy’ entered into things.
Yes. In all fairness I have no idea what Gill engaged in with his daughters, other than through very brief and sketchy condemnatory reports. So it was poor of me to call him ‘violently abusive’ without evidence.
I want children to experience pleasure, but I understand that some men get their pleasure through children experiencing pain. I have nothing to say on this: it happens in the world, and I will always defend children, and the pleasure, enjoyment and happiness of children wherever I am able.
But am I realistic? Of course. Some men get their pleasure from causing children pain. I do not know the complex psychological reasons behind this; I don’t know what precisely triggers the pleasure response in reaction to the fear and pain of any creature – but it obviously happens, and it has done for millions of years. In the animal kingdom, lions enjoy the fear and distress of their prey as they go in for the kill. We shouldn’t be squeamish about this.
Male lions have even been known to kill all of a rival’s cubs. This seems gratuitous and unnecessary – but it is technically still part of the cycle of life.
Am I a compassionate person? No, not at all; I view compassion as immoral weakness and a weapon used by inferior people to induce undeserving support.
Am I kind and loving? Absolutely. I usually restrict my kindness and love to my personal networks of association and my hierarchy of obligations.
But with kids, I just love every child unconditionally. I don’t want even the most evil child to suffer. I would protect them all if I could. But do I therefore hate on men who get their pleasure from children’s pain? No, not at all. As I said, there is a cycle of life which we must tolerate and accept as part of the natural order of things. In other words, we must be practical rather than idealistic.
Understood, Prue. I didn’t mean to be misleading about Gill.
Btw, what is your view on Freud’s concept of polymorphous perverse? The concept intrigues me.
>I think it’s pretty accurate. Or, at least holds merit. It does seem to be the case that human sexual feelings become increasingly genitally fixated over time.
That generally conforms to my own childhood, though unlike some who claim they have strong memories of early childhood, I invested most significance into sexual things by around age 10 or 11, so my memories before that time are virtually non-existent since they weren’t very important to me.
Generally, I accept and find credible what researchers’ in the past found when researching children’s sexuality, when social conditions and lack of an internet made sensitive scholarship less risky than today. Ernest Borneman’s research with tape recordings of children’s unmonitored sexual talk, seems authentic and reasonable to me.
As I see it, humans are sexual creatures from birth till death, with the focus much more dispersed / less fixated early on, and also more intense early on. Since sexual feelings are particularly intense during puberty and the teenage years, paranoia and regulation tends to target the vulnerable (pre-pubescent) or experience-hungry (post-pubescent) young. The latter being those who are liable to actually go out and “do it,” rather than inhibit themselves, if they are not rejected or socially shamed out of it like they have increasingly become in our time.
So yes, the concept of ‘polymorphous perverse’ doesn’t seem unreasonable or odd to me. Seems pretty accurate! What do you think?
Yes, polymorphous perverse seems accurate to me, especially if we consider mouth and anus to also be vital parts of a normal sexuality (which I do). Rimming, for example, is very standard and normal. Anal sex is so normal, as is fellatio and cunnilingus.
Perversion in terms of breaking of the skin – certainly not for me. Watersports – yes; shitting – reluctance.
BDSM – yes for me but only at the softer end.
I say this hypothetically as a Zero (i.e. a virgin).
What fascinates me, Prue, is the following, and maybe you can help my understanding here: we are classically told puberty is the onset of sexuality; or at least, a dramatic intensification and adultification of a pre-existing childish libidinal sexuality.
I challenge this premise. For me, the id brain craves sexual satisfaction essentially from birth, and finds relief in the breast, and in the oral and anal phases of very early childhood.
What I’m trying to say is: is it scientifically correct to call puberty the beginning of our generic, ‘mainstream’, and substantive sexuality – in terms of a qualitative, vital and existential human experience? Thank you.
Probably not, in terms of biological capacity. There’s adrenarche, and what’s been called ‘middle childhood,’ but puberty around the ages of 10 and beyond tends to increase the intensity of sexual feeling. So yes, I reckon you’re right in your line of thought here. Culturally, though, in terms of what’s permitted or likely given widespread attempts to enforce sexual innocence on the young and helicopter parent them until they nyon inevitably seek refuge and escape into the privacy of online spaces and video games: that’s a whole different subject!
The psychoanalytically inclined Ernest Borneman, in a 1983 paper, argued that “children’s sex life encompasses the child’s entire existence as a sexual being. In this sense, it may even be permissible to speak of prenatal sex life”. As summarized on Newgon:
If everything is an erogenous zone, surely that is the classic definition of polymorphous perverse? Usually mouth, anus and genitals obtain sexual pleasure, in oral, anal and vaginal sex, but in the cutaneous phase, which I suppose could be extended out to adulthood practice, perversion comes into play. Fetish, pain as a sexual stimulant, and use of faeces during sex are key examples. Also, if sexuality does not define a portion of our being but encompasses or subsumes our entire being, this has implications for the prime importance of sex in human life, culture and society (which is anyway unquestionable).
I doubt puberty increases the intensity of sexual feeling. Orgasm or the highest point of sexual pleasure is possible in babies. More like, culturally what’s permitted is that adolescents conveniently “discover” sex, having been sexually blocked by societal norms in their pre-adolescent phase.
Sexual innocence is not a precisely defined metric – is sexual innocence ignorance of the sexual function, or is it more reluctance to engage in a fuller spectrum of sexual possibilities? In which case innocence is a behaviourally unique personality trait tied to a narrower sexual range.
True sexual innocence is not the absence of sexual fantasies and desires, but the absence of sex-negative attitudes, which, like racism or homophobia, are learned from adults. Public concepts of innocence and virginity are social constructs caused by fear of child sexuality.
Just got called
n****
andneed psychological help
for supporting a 20 yr old with a 32 yr old. who was a rainbow person and religious. is it really worth living? im sure we all feel like that soemtimes but im really feeling it today…I get the impression that you like hanging out with morons and then complaining about receiving stupid comments from morons. As Dante said: “In church with the saintly, and in the tavern with the bibulous”…
I was replying to a vile person on facebook,actually. I dont know them. But i had to say something. A 19 yrbold girl. This generation is just as intolerant as witch hunters,racists and gay haters of the recent past…
You cannot be sure that a whole generation is like her just because you have met many of that kind. Bear in mind that social media is populated by losers, and precisely because they are losers, they know that they cannot manage to be better than others, so the only way they can rise above others is to bring others down. Therefore, my advice is the classic one: don’t feed the trolls, even if they tempt you to do so.
Are they really trolls though? the amount of anti rhetoric ive had off young people…. including my nephew.. someone in the pub talking about nonces being stabbed.. being called weird, creepy… although i did speak to one 19 year old who liked 47 year old ryan reynolds. so i just ahve to be like him
>It does help to be attractive, yes. No one, including yourself I’d imagine, wants to date or have sex w/ someone they’re not attracted to.
You don’t have to be ryan reynolds, but you do have to have something about you that a young woman’d be interested in. Women look to older men for what their male peers lack: a relaxed, agentic attitude to sex (not awkward), stability, and fun. That’s in addition to the baseline of finding you attractive enough to consider dating in the first place.
People want excitement; to see that they can at least have fun with you and perhaps, if it goes well, a good life. If you’re awkward, unattractive, don’t have a lot to offer a woman other than “I’m a good person on the inside, trust me bro,” then think again.
Ground Control to HereticTom: damn the off-topic torpedoes. Tell the bridge – target now acquired. Israel”
https://youtu.be/U661zM733BM?si=STcK_FEfobAx1fZT
I’d reckon Tom likes to keep up with and comment on current affairs, but doesn’t want HTOC becoming a constant “no Israel this,” “Palestine that” back ‘n’ forth.
Ultimately, we cannot discuss MAP rights without considering the wider context. This will involve dealing with contentious current events that may be controversial even within the MAP community. We do need to discuss these events, but without losing focus on the core matter that is MAP rights. It’s not black and white.
I have a question – how can you seriously make an organization for “the MAP community” when literally all of human history, and half the world at this moment, consists of men banging girls (and boys) under 18?
There is no “Minor Attracted People”. There is only HUMANITY. Sex negative feminists say there are “minor attracted people,” pretending like over half the world right now and the entirety of human history is some kind of aberration, which is absolutely ridiculous. You are agreeing with the feminists’ construction that what is the majority is actually a deviant minority.
>There is no “Minor Attracted People”. There is only HUMANITY…You are agreeing with the feminists’ construction that what is the majority is actually a deviant minority.
Interesting point. Ideally, there would be only humanity. In the meantime, there are discriminatory age of consent laws. That is what unavoidably gives significance to the concept of minors (those below the AOC) in the MAP construction – not constructed within feminist circles, BTW, although it could be argued that feminism (starting from proto-feminist social purity agitation in Victorian times) made some such construction inevitable.
Lord help us.
Adolescence a propaganda piece of the highest order, constructed for the explicit purpose of providing justification for deeper surveillance and censorship of social media, and, accordingly, the demonization of the beautiful boy.
I find it stunning that no one here sees any of this. That the most beautiful possible young boy is made the scapegoat is proof positive of the absolute nature of liberal Britain’s attack on boyhood. That the boy comes from a perfectly “normal” and loving family, rather than one rendered dysfunctional or at least disadvantaged by one or more any number of obvious factors, is proof positive of its attack on the family itself, and on the crucial, dominant role of fathers and men in the development of healthy boys. I have never seen such a hateful demonstration against masculinity at its most sensitive stage, nor such a blatant distraction from the actual demographics of sexual criminality of this sort. Nothing could be more myth-making than to portray a well-reared white-boy as perpetrator of such a crime.
Actually, to be honest, they could have added one more mythological figure: a strong male influence who was not the father, but attached to the boy in some way: that would be the ped, of course, and then the whole story would have revolved around the ped’s corrupting influence. But no: the point of this propaganda is to manifest a different monster: the monster of “toxic masculinity itself,” lurking in the internet with the capacity to lure any mildly adolescent with murderous hatred for the female…
It is stunning that “Jamie” has become a central figure in even your narrative of contemporary gender, youth, boyhood, etc. Jamie is a fake. There are no such 13 year old boys in contemporary Britain. Find me one. “Fictional – but all too plausible – young murderer,” you claim? Jamie is as bad a fake as any pedo-child-rapist-murderer as there ever was. You’re more likely to find me on of them.
Look: the whole entirely fictional series has led to hearings in parliament (featuring interviews with the series creator) concerning what to do about “this deep problem” — and what to do about it is, of course, to stamp out whatever embers still glow of boyhood as an anthropological reality.
That’s why this series was created.
Interesting, Franklin, but your indignation is a bit misplaced, I suggest. You write:
>Nothing could be more myth-making than to portray a well-reared white-boy as perpetrator of such a crime.
Jamie was much loved, as I said. It was a good family, but his dad was impulsive and inclined to lose his temper. This aspect of the script contributes to the plausibility of Jamie taking after his father.
Also, your implied racist suggestion that it’s black and brown boys who cause all the trouble, and butter wouldn’t melt in a white boy’s mouth is clearly far from the mark when we take far-right street thuggery into account, to say nothing of the toxic social media scene, as per the focus of the series, in which many white boys are enthusiastic participants.
>I have never seen such a hateful demonstration against masculinity at its most sensitive stage, nor such a blatant distraction from the actual demographics of sexual criminality of this sort.
Is it hateful to deplore murder? As for the demographics, you have a strong point. I don’t have figures to hand, but Google’s AI Overview has this on overall crime rates:
“In the UK, certain ethnic groups are overrepresented in arrests and victimizations, with Black and mixed ethnic groups showing higher arrest rates and victim rates compared to white individuals. However, it’s important to note that these differences don’t necessarily indicate a higher propensity for crime among these groups but may reflect other factors in the criminal justice system.”
I would also point out that the role of fiction is not to be statistically representative. Good TV drama is, well, dramatic. It creatively imagines possible scenarios in thought- and emotion-provoking ways. As such, any fiction can be accused of bias, including the history-based plays of Shakespeare, which worked as pro-Tudor propaganda. That doesn’t make them rubbish plays.
I am absolutely for “equality and diversity”, but only if it is truly equal and diverse, leftists call it “diversity” only when white prototypes are made black, but when blacks are made white, hysteria begins and everyone is shouting about “racism”. Where is the equality here ? Where is the freedom of choice here ? The boy in this story was made white not because creators had a choice, but because they didn’t, because otherwise the series would be called racist.
When it only works one way, it is still racism, only in reverse. This is reverse racism, and the signboard “equality and diversity” is actually just a hypocritical cover. The producers think that they are fighting racism in this one-sided way, but in fact they keep it. In the upcoming Harry Potter series, one of the main characters was made black, and now it turns out that Harry and his father will look like racists. This is insane.
>The boy in this story was made white not because creators had a choice, but because they didn’t, because otherwise the series would be called racist.
You’re right, Harlan! Good point. That said, I do feel most of the likely audience would find it easier to sympathise (as the script invites us to) with a white boy than a black one, both on account of anti-black stereotyping and thanks to the statistical reality that gives some credibility to the stereotype.
I think you are right. However, unless the producer stated the reasons for the ratial choice, we don’t know for sure, so we shouldn’t judge. From a pure anti-racist mindset, one should never care about the race of any character. We should care more about the conclusions people mistakenly draw from films, sensationalist headlines, ignorance, irrationality, insensitivity, etc.
But, yeah, that was a goog point. I actually have a friend of mine who always tries to draw conclusions from films and series, like trying to capture the lecture of it. I find it funny. Or scary, rather, since every choice scriptwriters make turns to have an impact in people’s opinions about the reality.
>Interesting, Franklin, but your indignation is a bit misplaced, I suggest. You write:
>>Nothing could be more myth-making than to portray a well-reared white-boy as perpetrator of such a crime.
>Jamie was much loved, as I said. It was a good family, but his dad was impulsive and inclined to lose his temper. This aspect of the script contributes to the plausibility of Jamie taking after his father.
I have known many people inclined to lose their temper, but a propensity for murder has not proven to follow. Is that the moral lesson here — “don’t lose your temper, or your son will murder?” Good God.
>Also, your implied racist suggestion that it’s black and brown boys who cause all the trouble, and butter wouldn’t melt in a white boy’s mouth is clearly far from the mark when we take far-right street thuggery into account, to say nothing of the toxic social media scene, as per the focus of the series, in which many white boys are enthusiastic participants.
There is nothing racist about pointing out that well-reared boys in Britain do not, whatever their demographics, stand out as a particularly pernicious threat to young girls, as difficult as child-rearing has come to be. The racism comes in where the white boy is made the scapegoat, for reasons which are obvious to any observer unwilling to acquiesce to the perverse etiquette of current British liberal discourse.
That’s another thing “Adolsecence” is designed to do, incidentally: to pre-load every criticism with the accusation of “racism.” This is built right into the whole spectacle of it. “Don’t you dare imagine a black boy, an immigrant boy, doing such a thing: don’t you dare.”
>>I have never seen such a hateful demonstration against masculinity at its most sensitive stage, nor such a blatant distraction from the actual demographics of sexual criminality of this sort.
>Is it hateful to deplore murder?
Are you serious? No, it is not hateful to deplore murder, but it is hateful to impute classes of people as responsible for murders they are not inclined commit; it is hateful to traffic in malicious mythologies that do not reflect reality as we know it.
Is it hateful of me to deplore Jews who sacrifice Christian babies? I really and truly do deplore all such Jews; don’t you? Have you stopped beating your children?
>As for the demographics, you have a strong point. I don’t have figures to hand, but Google’s AI Overview has this on overall crime rates:
>“In the UK, certain ethnic groups are overrepresented in arrests and victimizations, with Black and mixed ethnic groups showing higher arrest rates and victim rates compared to white individuals. However, it’s important to note that these differences don’t necessarily indicate a higher propensity for crime among these groups but may reflect other factors in the criminal justice system.”
I would hardly rely on Google’s AI for the time of day, though I will rely on to reveal biases of a woke bent, herewith obvious in its “important to note” commentary. The comment is not wrong, but again, what’s going on is precisely the sort of distortion “Adolescence” rides on and is intended to amplify.
>I would also point out that the role of fiction is not to be statistically representative. Good TV drama is, well, dramatic. It creatively imagines possible scenarios in thought- and emotion-provoking ways. As such, any fiction can be accused of bias, including the history-based plays of Shakespeare, which worked as pro-Tudor propaganda. That doesn’t make them rubbish plays.
Sure enough: one can make such claims about anything at all, which is what postmodernism’s reduction of everything to language games, propaganda, and power dynamics is all about. There is no one “role” of fiction. It can be put to many uses, and at its best it explores truths about the human condition, unashamedly, and as at a far a remove from a political agenda as possible. The more it aligns with political agenda, the worse it is, which is part of why “Adolescence” is such sheer shit. It is designed not simply to “imagine possible scenarios,” but to present specific scenarios according to a progressive, “anti-racist” (what a phrase), anti-male mode of story-telling, and to be provocative to the point of having politicians discuss it as if it were some sort of documentary of contemporary British life.
Good fiction does not, despite the most-modernists’ insistence, function essentially as a power play, as propaganda. But obviously it is not always wrong to analyze fiction in terms of its function as propaganda, especially when it is so obviously designed (unlike Shakespeare or Jane Austen) to serve as such. That is obviously what I am doing here: I am accusing the event of “Adolescence” of being, precisely, a piece of political propaganda, contrived to weave together important questions concerning “internet culture” and current ideas concerning masculinity (toxic), whiteness (toxic), the family (irrelevant), and gender (thoroughly confusing), for the sake of “progressive,” destructive, and illiberal ends intended by seemingly both right and left in contemporary British politics.
We are witnessing a wrecking ball being swung at the very idea of boyhood. (I would go on to say of childhood, of humanity, but put that aside.) The generosity of spirit you maintain here (which I also see in your tolerance of so much trans ideology) is being cynically exploited.
Quora wont allow answers to questions. everyone under 18 is considered an innocent and incapable baby. being threatened with ban. haha ill keep coming back
“I have tended to downplay “intersectionality”, which can all too easily degenerate into competitive victimhood …”
Intersectionality can be divisive when it is serves to compare the score of women and of various minorities on the oppression scale; this can happen in countries where identity politics flourishes, like the USA. However, it was initially conceived to unite the various oppressed groups, and this approach predominates in radical LGBT groups in some European countries. For instance, I have a small leaflet by a gay action group presenting its aims through a list of 25 things they stand for, ranging from sexual education at school to free Palestine and the inclusion of elderly people, and against, in particular hatred or discrimination targeting various conditions (sex work, madness, disability, drug addiction, …).
The current rules of consent are unfair. There have been terrible abuses (which are very difficult to prove in a trial since they often happen with no witnesses nor recordings), but we should never ever do unjust things to solve unjust situations – this thing has never worked. It’s the never-ending story of switching from oppressed to oppressor and vice versa. And I think that the reason why right-wing extermism is on the rise, especially amoung young people, is because there are many males who are not ok with current policies. Feminists are restricing sexual freedom and sexual opportunities for youth more and more, thinking that this will lead to less sexual aggressions (or, a more controlled society), but they are in fact rowing in the wrong direction.
Insightful as always, Tom! And yes, Owen Cooper is indeed an absolute stunner! I think this is my favourite photo of him – that brooding scowl… gorgeous! <3
So glad to see the BBC restored the statue! It really is a beautiful piece.
Keep well and stay safe all!
[MODERATOR: Unfortunately, the following long post is not very coherent. Zee, if you are going to post again, you will need to work harder to make your meaning clear. I suggest you concentrate on sending one clear paragraph, carefully checked, rather than a long string of unclear points. Please be aware that any further incoherent posts will be deleted.]
First of all , may I be excused for stating my below post from anything that may cause offense, its not my place to however I often feel that stating terms as they are are important, to fully understand the misguidance of social subjects from others. Others who would offer an opposing discussion without spelling it as it is and without the understanding of social history from the 70’s onwards.
From the political platform regarding the press, which we know are Tory biased propaganda farms, race and indeed bigotry have not moved far from the stereotypical social aura of the 70s. Its not as if we have less bent and corrupt coppers for example, Its not as if we have less racists either; we just have better information from the interweb about where and how bigotry exists. This can be explained no better than the “Two Tier Policing” excuse from the riff-raff that Western mentality have to offer. An analogy could be it is a idea that “The dirt is always dirtier on the other side of the fence” as a way to make excuses to fit, when the unthinkable of societal scrutiny comes to visit. It is not surprising what the Police and the press, wanted to portray Rudakubana as the “Wild Coon from the boats “. It is of no accident, although that kid would possibly so messed up, so angry, so mentally unstable that. nobody could cut that hair without a sedative and thats a whole other jar of bees as far as human rights go. So would it have been better not to publish a photo at all ? I like to think so but… how often has press reform and contesting the rights of the press been long overdue for scrutiny.
It’s the same corrupt social standing on moral panics, people are all too eager to “string up a pedo”, if we were to coin a stereotypical phrase from the British Tabloids. As long as the detachment is in the favour of attitude. Nobody wants to think their child could be a pedophile, an incel, a killer in the making or whatever. So much of humanity and indeed westernized conviction is based on detachment of seeking truths of societal reform from beyond the front door. Yesterday its the pedophiles as the boogeyman of fear. Today we add the Incels, the Muslims, the immigrants when the real danger is the politicians and the closed minded ignorance they constantly manipulate without open and balanced discourse and debate.
We need less thought policing and more time and resources spent on understanding why these so called “flaws” exist in society…if they are indeed flaws.
Sexuality is not a flaw…, displacement, abandonment, lack of channeling of support networks because they oppose the ideals of societal paragons that Christian society fits as a design for social regulation is the flaw. Especially when they detach the human rights of people to be understood without societal bias.
As a side note, incels are not just incels because of sexual contact or the lack, its about being understood, nurtured, opportunity to be seen as people. To be seen as valid and having identity and a place in in the world Young people are not “kids” they are miniature people in the making of adulthood. We could say MAPS are possible incels… would this be a correct observation as they too are “involuntary celibate”?
Are MAPs the lost answer to solve both problems? That’s another story as it’s not an all encompassing need for every growing experience. But the more I hear of experiences between others who have placed positivity for those with past intergenerational partners and actually make correlation to the love lives they have today, shows there is more need for empathy and freedom of sexual and cultural expression that traditional constitution is failing young people… badly!!
I’ve no idea what the word incel means. I shall have to Google it. And although I’ve never seen Adolescence, you are right, Tom that Owen Cooper is drop dead gorgeous. I have no doubt that millions of BoyLovers would agree with you. As to his fictional crime, well, there were many people I was attracted to as a youngster, but I would never have attacked them with a knife just because they didn’t love me back. That wouldn’t have made them change their mind about me. As for Axel Rudakabana, his police mugshot makes him look like a 19th century Sudanese Fuzzy Wuzzy and if there was one thing we all know about the Fuzzy Wuzzies, it’s that they definitely did NOT like it up ’em! Well, according to Corporal Jones in “Dad’s Army”, who appeared to be very handy with his rifle bayonet during the Sudanese campaign. I hope that by now the prison authorities have had his hair cut or some inmate might eventually get the urge to go to work on his rectum with a knife.
The definition given in Wikipedia is one-sided and negatively coloured, conveying a feminist narrative.
IMO the real definition is –
“Incels” are a group of people of different sexes, genders and sexualities (not exclusively heterosexual males) who, due to cultural and social prejudices, cannot find a romantic or sexual partner.
This is a socio-cultural phenomenon has become more widespread due to the accumulation of sex-negative narratives in western society, obsessed with victimological myths, which, at the incitement of leftist activists, gave rise to phenomena such as “Social Justice Warriors” and “Cancel culture”, leading to an increase in accusations of sexual abuse. It is not surprising that in such an atmosphere the number of incels is growing.
Warning: lengthy, “edgy,” but hopefully easy to read and thoughtful post about Axel incoming!!!
Axel killed 3 very young girls in a public place, injured more than 10 people including adults and children. He will never again have even the possibility of a “normal” life, and will likely die in prison from old age or being attacked by other inmates.
This case was unprecedented, highly unusual, and has been used disingenuously to stoke racial tensions. In particular, via prejudiced and false assumptions that the killer was a Muslim man when in-fact he was not.
Axel was simply a brown-skinned, very disturbed teenager. We know from chronologies of his life, that Axel had been the subject of multiple interventions from social services, had a difficult school life where he was bullied and even once brought a knife to school for protection, and ultimately became isolated and reclusive. The year before the attack, my source states that Axel had “stopped engaging with mental health workers, [was] struggling to attend school[,] and ha[d] anxiety that makes him unwilling to leave his house.”
The judge who handed down his 50+ year sentence, stated that there is “no evidence” of a “a particular political or ideological cause” for the attack. Quote:
I have no particular blood-lust for Axel. I won’t take inspiration from him and start “stabbing” anyone because they’re an easy target, let alone going “to work on his rectum with a knife.” Axel’s room was found to have Ricin, a strong poison in it. It’s highly likely he intended to kill himself after the attack. Axel’s punishment is having to live with what he’s done: spending at least 50 years of his life behind bars, being one of the most hated people in the UK if not the world, and living in constant fear and risk to his life for actions he took when he was 18-years-old – no matter how he changes or if his mental health dramatically improves. He may never have a sexual partner, be able to build a family, or just enjoy many everyday freedoms that we take for granted.
I’ve spent years now, criticizing the media’s framing of MAPs, “sex offenders,” and non-normative sexual behavior in general, so the terrifying mugshot of Axel does nothing to sway me. In fact, a quick image search shows images of a much younger Axel, and even a court sketch, where unlike his police mugshot, he has lips! Did anyone realize that?! Axel actually does have lips!! XD The police mugshot, as is the case with high profile criminal cases, is designed to be as ugly and disturbing as possible. It’s oddly low resolution and looks like they’ve airbrushed his lips out, looking like he’s sucking a sour lemon or something… As with any sensitive story, the more obviously biased the framing, the more I get suspicious and look into the person themselves. Try to find the reason or context to their actions, including a case as horrible and strange as Axel’s…
When it comes to physical violence especially, you can’t undo an act once it’s done. Those girl’s aren’t coming back from the grave anytime soon. You can, however, try to prevent crime before it happens. Despite being investigated and referred to services multiple times over many years of his young life, Axel was failed by a system that has not only been underfunded by decades of austerity cuts under successive UK Conservative governments, but is also ineffective at preventing serious crime by meaningfully improving people’s mental health.
Axel, for example, could’ve done with medication, regular unannounced room inspections, a social services / mental health professional assigned to live with him or live nearby, and to have that same professional come to school to observe his school life, as inconspicuously as possible (e.g. by posing as a substitute teacher). In the wake of Axel’s crimes, schools and families will be far more amenable to such interventions.
Axel’s parents, very similar to Jamie’s parents in Netflix’s Adolescence, very likely blame themselves. At the very least, they’ll be thinking “what could we have done differently?” The reality is, not a lot. Stopping him from going outside won’t make him feel any less bitter at the world; people need friends, meaning and purpose: Hope! Like Jamie’s parents who thought he was “safe” in his room on the computer, in reality, lots of time spent online probably doesn’t help. The online world suffers from negativity bias, and likely compound’s many people’s negative perceptions of the world. Young people nowadays, are bombarded by negative messaging, about the economy, about dating, about the future of the planet if we’re to be facing the ravages of global warming / climate change in decades to come.
It’s a really fucked, sad situation, and young people with no money, all-the-worse if they’ve no friends or face bullying and isolation, bear the brunt of a near systemic inability to improve their lives before they come of age. Certainly, there’s an entire “distraction economy,” designed to keep you staring at screens for as long as possible. Then there’s porn, edgy politics, and great TV and cartoons: a lot there to keep a person isolated and unhappy.
I’ll just end by saying: Fuck Tommy Robinson! :p
Wait- i thought he was 17? therefore
innocent
. oh, people rather bizzarely change their minds… actually, they dont have minds at all. i even mentioned the hypocrisy on facebook. i got one like….13 year old incel?? im 40 odd and im an incel…. i dotn remember beign frustated about not gettin laid at 13! but yes i did have frustration not having any experience at all until 19. which is why i want to be with teens to make up for it. but of course, thats rather difficult….
It doesn’t seem accurate to compare the character of Jamie Miller to Axel Rudakubana. Incels aren’t necessarily violent, and their motivations go beyond cruelty and transgression for their own sake.
>Incels aren’t necessarily violent
Yes, I know. But the point of the TV series is that it is about an incel (or incel-identifying) boy who was violent. Indeed, like Rudakubana, Jamie was very violent, a murderer. We can sympathise with Jamie because we hear his backstory. What do we know about Rudakubana’s personal history? Hardly anything, so far as I can tell. All we know is that he is a seriously nasty piece of work!
but of course in america 17 year olds are deemed innocent so he was therefore incapable. oh wait, they change their mind when they do this. take aphoto of him though.. hm , i sound like a stuck reord but i cant help it
I would like to add a caveat to the assertions about Israel and the support it gets in the West: it is not Israel that harms the children of Palestine, but rather Hamas who uses children as human shields in their genocidal campaign against both Jews and their own people. If Hamas were to unconditionally surrender, the war will end.
>it is not Israel that harms the children of Palestine, but rather Hamas who uses children as human shields in their genocidal campaign against both Jews and their own people.
Check, one among many more insiders fake-media BLOCKED. An angry IDF Veteran KNOWS that Oct 7 was yet another ‘Inside Job’ to self-justify ZioNazis grotesquely over-reacting to land grab sunny Gaza and trillion-dollar offshore gas field. For Nazty Netanyahu’s ‘Final Solution’ to eliminate all Palestinians (especially innocent Palestinian kids) from Palestine!
Extend 1950s Anglo fascist anti-commie McCarthy’s fake witch-hunts, “Reds under the beds – Hamas under the tents!!”
An angry IDF veteran KNOWS it was an Inside Job. To let Hamas attack for Israel to then grossly over-react and take the whole Gaza strip and HIGH VALUE Gaza Marine Gas Field. “You don’t think there’s anything fishy going on here?! I know all these things first hand because I served on the Gaza border. In less than 5 minutes it all could have been over it could have been a matter of 5 minutes before the whole thing was upended and instead they had SEVEN HOURS possibly eight to conquer a Kibbutz kill thousands and bring back hostages alive unopposed. And there’s many people that say, ‘Oh well this was just a breach’. NO! That’s not a breach I’m sorry that’s NOT a breach!!”
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQBpyozbaMs
MODERATOR:
Unfortunately, Cyril, I cannot allow your comment, as it could easily be interpreted as antisemitic “hate speech”. In the UK, “hate speech”, even in blog comments, can be criminal if it is threatening, abusive, or insulting and intended to stir up racial, religious, or other forms of hatred. While free speech is protected, it can be restricted when it incites violence or hatred against racial and other legally protected groups.
The comment to which you were responding, by contrast, was directed against Hamas, which has been deemed a terrorist organisation by the UK government. It does not fall within a legally protected category.
It may be felt the impact on free speech of British law looks one-sided in this respect, but HTOC must abide by the law as it stands. If I had my way the present Israeli government would be declared a terrorist organisation and its leaders brought to trial for crimes against humanity. But that is an opinion against a government, not against the Jewish religion, which I accord as much respect as Christianity, Islam, atheism, etc.
What I can allow, though, is mention of the sources you have given, which refer critically to the teachings of the eminent mediaeval Jewish scholar Maimonides. Readers may judge for themselves whether, or to what extent, this source is relevant to the current situation: https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/1181854/jewish/Mamrim-Chapter-3.htm
Another source, which Cyril also cites, is more concise and accessible to the modern reader:
https://web.archive.org/web/20060831092249/http://www.talkreason.org/articles/sources.pdf
I will allow you to post again on this subject if you wish, Cyril, but you must be careful to comply with the law.
I’m wondering why you respect religions, especially a racist one, containing genuine hate speech against Goys. There is no “free speech protected”, it is Jewish censorship even here!
And talking about Hamas, I wouldn’t believe in everything said about 2023 attacks – in Jewish fathers protecting their families with scissors in their hands, in 40 beheaded Jewish children, in Jewish babies baked in ovens and in other propagandist bullshit. Jews dismiss dead Deir Yassin children as “a blood libel”, so we should follow Jewish example and dismiss 2023 attacks and Holocaust as blood anti-Goyish libel.
I am sure you are right, Cyril, that the most lurid accounts of the 7 October attacks were false. Wild rumours and outright lies are inevitable in conflict scenarios.
It would be wrong to dismiss either the 2023 attacks or the Holocaust, but it would also be wrong to deny the blood-soaked terrorist origins of Israel in the 1940s, when local populations were violently “ethnically cleansed” to make way for the new Jewish incomers.
You are right to remember the Deir Yassin children. This was long before most heretics here were born and few will have heard of the massacre. WP’s page about it starts with this:
The last paragraph of the introductory section interestingly ends with this sentence: “Material in Israeli military archives documenting the Deir Yassin massacre remains classified.”
It is not difficult to see why they might prefer to bury the truth.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre
Yes! I was so surprised to know that terrorist Menachem Begin had got a Nobel prize!
Wow, thank you Tom! Great blog post as always.
Only on the topic of Palestine, I cannot recommend enough the “Martyr Made” podcast by Darryl Cooper, long-form with only 32 episodes since 2015, biased of course, but rich on information nevertheless. If someone wants to get a wider picture on the conflict, it is a great resource.